michiru's avatar
michiru

Jan. 8, 2024

0
About Kanji - The first part

When I check Japanese sentences by Japanese learners, I often see kanji in phrases where Japanese people don't use kanji. Then, I wonder what to tell them. That kanji they used is not wrong, but we usually use hiragana there. I take that they study Japanese by reading old novels.

People in old times used kanji in almost phrases, but most of those kanji words are currently not used anymore . As a matter of fact, kids don't learn them in schools.

As you know, kanji was imported from China long time ago. Kanji characters exist as many as I can’t count, however, some of them are dead. That means we’ve never used those characters, otherwise, we don't know even the existence of them because we’ve never seen them.


漢字について 前編

日本語学習者の和文を見ると、我々が漢字を使わない語句で漢字を使っているの見る時があります。その時、どう教えたらいいものか悩みます。彼らが使う漢字は間違いではないのですが、通常、我々はその語句はひらがなで書いているのです。彼らは古い小説で日本語を勉強していると受け取りました。

昔の人々は大抵の語句に漢字を使っていましたが、そのほとんどが現在ではもう使われていません。実際、子供達は学校で習っていません。

ご存知の通り、漢字は大昔に中国から輸入されました。私が数え切れない程の漢字が存在します。しかし、死語もあります。つまり、我々が全く使ったことがない漢字があり、それどころか、見たことがないので存在すら知らない漢字もあります。

Corrections

About Kanji - The first partPart 1

When I check Japanese sentences written by Japanese learners, I often see kanji in phrases where Japanese people don't use kanji.

Then, I wonder what to tell them.

Thate kanji that they used in some words is not wrong, but we usually use hiragana there.in those words.

I take thatwonder if they study Japanese by reading old novels.

People in olda long times ago used kanji in almost every phrases, but most of those kanji words are currentlyare not used anymore .

As a matter of fact, kids don't learn them in schools.

As you know, kanji was imported from China long time ago.

Kanji characters exist as many asThere are more kanji characters than I can’t count, h. However, some of them are deano longer used.

That means we’vNot only do we never used those characters, otherwise,but we don't even know eventhat they existence of them because we’ve never seen them.

michiru's avatar
michiru

Jan. 14, 2024

0

Thank you very much for correcting!

When I chorreckt Japanese sentences by Japanese learners, I often see kanji in phrases where Japanese people don't use kanji.

I put "correct" instead of "check" because it is more specific in this context.

Then, I wonder what to tell them in this scenario. / I wonder what to tell them in this situation / I wonder what to tell them when I see them use kanji incorrectly.

There's a few ways you could phrase this sentence. I gave you 3 suggestions.

Thate kanji they used is not wrong, but we usually use hiragana there.

I take it that they study Japanese by reading old novels.

People in old times used kanji in almthoste phrases, but most of those kanji words are currently not used anymore .

I wasn't sure about your meaning here in this sentence. I tried to relate it back to your previous comment about kanji being in the wrong places

As a matter ofIn fact, kids don't learn them in schools.

I changed the transition to have some variation in this sentence versus the following sentence after that.

As you know, kanji was imported from China long time ago.

Kanji characters exist aThere are countless mkany as I can’t count, however,ji characters but some of them are dead.not in use.

That means we’ve never don't used those characters, otherwise, we don't know even the existence of them. We don't even know what they are because we’ve never seen them.

Using "them" twice in this structure sounds awkward to a native speaker.

michiru's avatar
michiru

Jan. 9, 2024

0

Thank you very much for correcting! "In fact" is a new to me. I took a note.

People in old times used kanji in almost phrases, but most of those kanji words are currently non’t used anymore .

Redundant

As you may know, kanji was imported from China a long time ago.

Using “as you know” when you haven’t told the reader the fact is awkward. It’s grammatically correct, but it makes me feel kind of offended even though I did know that kanji comes from China.

KCountless kanji characters exist as many as I can’t count, h. However, some of them are dead.

There are multiple correct ways to write this besides how I did, but they don’t go with “however.” General rule of thumb: if you put a comma after “however,” you should put a period before it.

That means we’ve never used those characters, otherwise, w. We don't know even they existence of them because we’ve never seen them.

“Otherwise” doesn’t work here. You first have to establish when you do use the kanji first, and then you can use “otherwise” to say that you don’t in any other situations.

Feedback

You’ve got the gist of the grammar down. It just needs a little refinement.

michiru's avatar
michiru

Jan. 9, 2024

0

Thank you very much for correcting!

Using may, might, could, would is hard for me, but I’ll try to use those.

I got how to use however. I kind of understand the difference between however and but from your advice.

When I check Japanese sentences by Japanese learners, I often see kanji in phrases where Japanese people don't use(*) kanji.

"Don't use" seems fine to me, but I think "wouldn't use" might be a little better. Phrasing it as "where Japanese people were refer to use kana" might be a little more natural. We're describing a tendency or trend so "would" feels a bit more accurate.

Then, I wonder what to tell them in such situations.

Looking at the Japanese version, a better translation for "その時" might be "at such times," but "in such situations" felt more clear.

That kanji they used is not wrong, but we would usually use hiragana there.

Again, "would" for describing a trend.

People in old times tended to used kanji in almost phrases, but most of those kanji words are currently not used anymore .

Looking at the Japanese version and seeing what my translation might be...

昔の人々は大抵の語句に漢字を使っていましたが
The people long ago would tend to use kanji in their phrases.

I think your phrasing is better than my translation in parts, but "almost" should probably either be "almost all phrases" or just "most phrases" which is what felt more natural to me. "Almost phrases" means something like "things that aren't quite phrases" which doesn't make a lot of sense.

As you know, kanji wasere imported from China long time ago.

"Kanji" on its own is generally considered a plural word in English, so "were" instead of "was".

There are more Kanji characters exist as many asthan I can’t count, however, some of them are dead.

My translation of the Japanese text as literally as possible:

私が数え切れない程の漢字が存在します。
A number I cannot count of kanji exist.

I feel the most natural way to say this would be, perhaps exaggeratory, but "an uncountable number of kanji exist." Casually: "There are a ridiculous number of kanji."

That means we’ve never used those characters, otherwise,r sometimes we don't know even know they existence of them because we’ve never seen them.

Feedback

"Should I learn the kanji or kana version of this word?" is a common question in learning forums. The typical answer is that we should only remember the kanji if we see it written in kanji. However, at one point I saw 眼鏡 in a video and someone told me that it'd more often be spelled メガネ so it can be hard to tell. And as you point out, maybe some people are reading old books.

michiru's avatar
michiru

Jan. 9, 2024

0

Thank you very much for correcting!
I think I got the difference between almost and most from your advice.
To avoid assertive expressions, I have to learn about would.

It has a tendency to use Katakana instead of kanji these days. I don't want to write lots of kanji because of many strokes.......

About Kanji - The first part

Or "Part 1"

When I check Japanese sentences by Japanese learners, I often see kanji in phrases where Japanese people don't use kanji.

ThenIn those cases, I wonder what to tell them.

This is a smoother transition.

Thate kanji they used is are not wrong, but we usually use hiragana therein such cases.

I take it that they study Japanese by reading old novels.

People in old times used kanji in almost phrases, but most of those kanji words are currently not used anymore .

As a matter of fact, kids don't learn them in schools.

As you know, kanji was imported from China a long time ago.

Kanji characters exist as many asThere are more kanji characters than I can’t count, h. However, some of them are dead.

That meansIn other words, we’ve never used those characters, otherwise,r we don't even know even they existence of them because we’ve never seen them.

Feedback

Interesting. What sorts of phrases are you referring to? Some Japanese dictionaries will offer the kanji representation of some words, but will usually say something like "usually written using kana alone."

michiru's avatar
michiru

Jan. 9, 2024

0

Thank you very much for correcting! I’m glad I can learn "in those cases" and "in such cases".

I saw someone wrote "詰まらない" on this site. The meaning is "It's boring." Using the kanji character "詰" is correct, but we usually write "つまらない" all in hiragana. Honestly, I’ve never seen 詰まらない so far and didn’t even know that つまらない can be expressed in kanji.
Yes, I don't read many books, much less old novels.
Even after I learned 詰まらない, I don't think I want to use it. Because no one can understand it around me. My friends and colleagues also don't know it.
However, some Japanese persons use difficult kanji characters on purpose. They just want to brag their knowledge. My friends and I call these persons "big head."

deux_ex_machina's avatar
deux_ex_machina

Jan. 9, 2024

0

Hahaha. Thank you! I haven't seen 詰まらない as a learner either.
Although, because of the way Japanese input on computers works, maybe this person entered つまらない and asked the computer to insert kanji automatically.
It's like typing 綺麗 instead of きれい. It's also correct, but I personally wouldn't be able to write this down on paper.

Then, I wonder what to tell them.


ThenIn those cases, I wonder what to tell them.

This is a smoother transition.

Then, I wonder what to tell them in such situations.

Looking at the Japanese version, a better translation for "その時" might be "at such times," but "in such situations" felt more clear.

Then, I wonder what to tell them in this scenario. / I wonder what to tell them in this situation / I wonder what to tell them when I see them use kanji incorrectly.

There's a few ways you could phrase this sentence. I gave you 3 suggestions.

This sentence has been marked as perfect!

That kanji they used is not wrong, but we usually use hiragana there.


Thate kanji they used is are not wrong, but we usually use hiragana therein such cases.

That kanji they used is not wrong, but we would usually use hiragana there.

Again, "would" for describing a trend.

Thate kanji they used is not wrong, but we usually use hiragana there.

Thate kanji that they used in some words is not wrong, but we usually use hiragana there.in those words.

About Kanji - The first part


About Kanji - The first part

Or "Part 1"

About Kanji - The first partPart 1

When I check Japanese sentences by Japanese learners, I often see kanji in phrases where Japanese people don't use kanji.


This sentence has been marked as perfect!

When I check Japanese sentences by Japanese learners, I often see kanji in phrases where Japanese people don't use(*) kanji.

"Don't use" seems fine to me, but I think "wouldn't use" might be a little better. Phrasing it as "where Japanese people were refer to use kana" might be a little more natural. We're describing a tendency or trend so "would" feels a bit more accurate.

When I chorreckt Japanese sentences by Japanese learners, I often see kanji in phrases where Japanese people don't use kanji.

I put "correct" instead of "check" because it is more specific in this context.

When I check Japanese sentences written by Japanese learners, I often see kanji in phrases where Japanese people don't use kanji.

As a matter of fact, kids don't learn them in schools.


As a matter of fact, kids don't learn them in schools.

As a matter ofIn fact, kids don't learn them in schools.

I changed the transition to have some variation in this sentence versus the following sentence after that.

This sentence has been marked as perfect!

As you know, kanji was imported from China long time ago.


As you know, kanji was imported from China a long time ago.

As you know, kanji wasere imported from China long time ago.

"Kanji" on its own is generally considered a plural word in English, so "were" instead of "was".

As you may know, kanji was imported from China a long time ago.

Using “as you know” when you haven’t told the reader the fact is awkward. It’s grammatically correct, but it makes me feel kind of offended even though I did know that kanji comes from China.

As you know, kanji was imported from China long time ago.

This sentence has been marked as perfect!

Kanji characters exist as many as I can’t count, however, some of them are dead.


Kanji characters exist as many asThere are more kanji characters than I can’t count, h. However, some of them are dead.

There are more Kanji characters exist as many asthan I can’t count, however, some of them are dead.

My translation of the Japanese text as literally as possible: 私が数え切れない程の漢字が存在します。 A number I cannot count of kanji exist. I feel the most natural way to say this would be, perhaps exaggeratory, but "an uncountable number of kanji exist." Casually: "There are a ridiculous number of kanji."

KCountless kanji characters exist as many as I can’t count, h. However, some of them are dead.

There are multiple correct ways to write this besides how I did, but they don’t go with “however.” General rule of thumb: if you put a comma after “however,” you should put a period before it.

Kanji characters exist aThere are countless mkany as I can’t count, however,ji characters but some of them are dead.not in use.

Kanji characters exist as many asThere are more kanji characters than I can’t count, h. However, some of them are deano longer used.

That means we’ve never used those characters, otherwise, we don't know even the existence of them because we’ve never seen them.


That meansIn other words, we’ve never used those characters, otherwise,r we don't even know even they existence of them because we’ve never seen them.

That means we’ve never used those characters, otherwise,r sometimes we don't know even know they existence of them because we’ve never seen them.

That means we’ve never used those characters, otherwise, w. We don't know even they existence of them because we’ve never seen them.

“Otherwise” doesn’t work here. You first have to establish when you do use the kanji first, and then you can use “otherwise” to say that you don’t in any other situations.

That means we’ve never don't used those characters, otherwise, we don't know even the existence of them. We don't even know what they are because we’ve never seen them.

Using "them" twice in this structure sounds awkward to a native speaker.

That means we’vNot only do we never used those characters, otherwise,but we don't even know eventhat they existence of them because we’ve never seen them.

People in old times used kanji in almost phrases, but most of those kanji words are currently not used anymore .


People in old times used kanji in almost phrases, but most of those kanji words are currently not used anymore .

People in old times tended to used kanji in almost phrases, but most of those kanji words are currently not used anymore .

Looking at the Japanese version and seeing what my translation might be... 昔の人々は大抵の語句に漢字を使っていましたが The people long ago would tend to use kanji in their phrases. I think your phrasing is better than my translation in parts, but "almost" should probably either be "almost all phrases" or just "most phrases" which is what felt more natural to me. "Almost phrases" means something like "things that aren't quite phrases" which doesn't make a lot of sense.

People in old times used kanji in almost phrases, but most of those kanji words are currently non’t used anymore .

Redundant

People in old times used kanji in almthoste phrases, but most of those kanji words are currently not used anymore .

I wasn't sure about your meaning here in this sentence. I tried to relate it back to your previous comment about kanji being in the wrong places

People in olda long times ago used kanji in almost every phrases, but most of those kanji words are currentlyare not used anymore .

I take that they study Japanese by reading old novels.


I take it that they study Japanese by reading old novels.

I take it that they study Japanese by reading old novels.

I take thatwonder if they study Japanese by reading old novels.

You need LangCorrect Premium to access this feature.

Go Premium